Pages: (4) [1] 2 3 ... Last »  ( Go to first unread post ) Reply to this topicStart new topicStart Poll
> Concord Taurus Sectors
Quote Post
uncle_jimbo, Group: Grid Cop, 5éme Corbin submitted 63 Resources has rated 119 resources, submitted 0 artworks and is involved with 3 projects.

Author (uncle_jimbo @ Jan 31 2016, 18:37)
Did [the Galactic Concord section of the Stellar Nations Netbook] get as far as naming sectors in Concord Taurus?

Without any reply to this, I'll presume not and put up here what I developed as background that's partly appeared in The Taurus Contract campaign suggestion.

Sectors of Concord Taurus

A previous effort, the Concord Appraisal, harmonised various conflicting standards of stellar cartography.

Former Taurean Star Republic
Ravenna - absorbed by Thuldan Empire
St. Mark - absorbed by Thuldan Empire
Harlequin
Epirus
Lucian - described briefly in The Taurus Contract (henceforth TC)
Cornelius - TC

Former Sothvec Industries
Okavango
Holstein
Wolfshead - TC

Former Sultanate of Fomalhaut
Fomalhaut
Malacca
Zanzibar - absorbed by Thuldan Empire
Mazoon - absorbed by Thuldan Empire
Morning Light - TC

Former StarMech Collective
Calvin - TC
Palmyra - TC
Chatoyant - I'll have more to say about this one
Pair o' Dice - under objections from StarMech, increasingly known only as Taurus One
offline PM Email Poster Users Website
Quote Post
cobalt_phoenix, Group: Heroes, Beyond Level 20 submitted 2 Resources has rated 6 resources, submitted 0 artworks and is involved with 0 projects.

Nice, Jim. A quick question, though. Are these suppose to be sectors on par with the Verge in terms of size? I only ask because the Verge is about 100 x 100 x 100 ly, and the Stellar Ring is 200 ly from top to bottom (supposedly, though I guess that could just be around the area of Sol).

Thinking about it, though, I will say that you should consider tapping other languages for the names. Zanzibar isn't a terrible name, but I'm not sure about the likelihood of them naming a sector that if the stellar nation was predominately from the Middle East. I would think that they may instead focus on historical names or modern ideas when naming the sectors.
offline PM Email Poster
Quote Post
uncle_jimbo, Group: Grid Cop, 5éme Corbin submitted 63 Resources has rated 119 resources, submitted 0 artworks and is involved with 3 projects.

Author (cobalt_phoenix @ Sep 4 2016, 19:07)
Nice, Jim.  A quick question, though.  Are these suppose to be sectors on par with the Verge in terms of size?  I only ask because the Verge is about 100 x 100 x 100 ly, and the Stellar Ring is 200 ly from top to bottom (supposedly, though I guess that could just be around the area of Sol).

Is the Verge called a sector anywhere? I thought of them as similar in size to those shown in the Stellar Nation Netbook finished chapters, which vary in size between nations, probably rightly so, but for the closest nations, show 10 sectors in StarMech space and 28 in the Thuldan Empire.

Table S7, page 82 of the Campaign Setting gives the number of Defense Sectors for each stellar nation. Now that I reread and think about it, that probably suggests there should be roughly 10 sectors in Concord Taurus (a third of the Galactic Concord's complement of 30). I might have a few too many, or I could say the Concord altered some of the historical divisions to a consistent size. In fact, I've already said as much.

There's a scale bar on the Stellar Ring map, which makes the stellar nations' current extent definitely larger than 200 lightyears. That's about right for the thickness of a disc (top to bottom) that would contain a reasonable density of stars worthwhile to claim.

Author
Thinking about it, though, I will say that you should consider tapping other languages for the names.  Zanzibar isn't a terrible name, but I'm not sure about the likelihood of them naming a sector that if the stellar nation was predominately from the Middle East.  I would think that they may instead focus on historical names or modern ideas when naming the sectors.


At the risk of being obtuse, Fomalhaut isn't in the Middle East. It's .. damn. 25 lightyears. That's much closer than I thought. (Which, by the way, means that any Fomalhaut Sector in Concord Taurus doesn't contain the Fomalhaut system, and may never have done so. It's unquestionably in Solar space.) However, to continue, the Sultanate was an extrasolar settlement whose organisation as a stellar nation very likely was not derived from any Earth government, which would have been part of the Terran Empire, their GW I enemy. We can't say much more than that the founding leaders were probably of Muslim background and may have been influenced more by legend and literature than historical continuity. I've mentioned elsewhere some connotations of the title "sultan". I had in mind that they drew from a number of present-day countries, particularly the Gulf states and Malaysia, but they could have been no more Middle Eastern than .. best not to get distracted by random examples.

In any case, if the Thuldans absorbed and abolished that sector, it doesn't greatly matter.

This post has been edited by uncle_jimbo on Sep 4 2016, 09:30
offline PM Email Poster Users Website
Quote Post
Guardian, Group: Heroes, WarHulk AI submitted 2 Resources has rated 11 resources, submitted 0 artworks and is involved with 0 projects.

I always figured the Sultanate lost Fomalhaut to the proto-Solars during GWI and never bothered to change the name.
offline PM Email Poster
Quote Post
cobalt_phoenix, Group: Heroes, Beyond Level 20 submitted 2 Resources has rated 6 resources, submitted 0 artworks and is involved with 0 projects.

Author
Is the Verge called a sector anywhere?


Yup. Page 86, column 2, first paragraph: "All in all, the Verge is a sector of space about 100 light-years long, wide, and deep."


Author
I thought of them as similar in size to those shown in the Stellar Nation Netbook finished chapters, which vary in size between nations, probably rightly so, but for the closest nations, show 10 sectors in StarMech space and 28 in the Thuldan Empire.

Table S7, page 82 of the Campaign Setting gives the number of Defense Sectors for each stellar nation. Now that I reread and think about it, that probably suggests there should be roughly 10 sectors in Concord Taurus (a third of the Galactic Concord's complement of 30). I might have a few too many, or I could say the Concord altered some of the historical divisions to a consistent size. In fact, I've already said as much.


The problem with using "defense sectors" is that they are never defined in terms of what they are. Are they all the same size, or does it vary by nation? Are they geographically identical cubes, or are they organized around specific stars and thus can vary within a stellar nation?

I would lean more towards thinking of a defense sector as being similar to the numbered fleets of the US Navy. In that case, they are somewhat geographical, but they are intended to organize the defensive forces of a stellar nation. As a result, I assume they may or may not be administrative (that would depend on the stellar nation), and they may not all be the same size.


Author
There's a scale bar on the Stellar Ring map, which makes the stellar nations' current extent definitely larger than 200 lightyears. That's about right for the thickness of a disc (top to bottom) that would contain a reasonable density of stars worthwhile to claim.


Humanity has mapped out an region of space that is about 2000 ly across and 200 ly deep, which is on page 41 (first paragraph under the Open Space heading). So, at best, the Stellar Ring is 200 ly deep (which it probably is in Old Space, which is said to be everything within 200 ly of Sol, second paragraph under The Stellar Ring on page 39). It doesn't actually say how far the Ring extends, as it is the area annexed by the stellar nations, which varies dramatically.


Author
At the risk of being obtuse, Fomalhaut isn't in the Middle East. It's .. damn. 25 lightyears. That's much closer than I thought. (Which, by the way, means that any Fomalhaut Sector in Concord Taurus doesn't contain the Fomalhaut system, and may never have done so. It's unquestionably in Solar space.) However, to continue, the Sultanate was an extrasolar settlement whose organisation as a stellar nation very likely was not derived from any Earth government, which would have been part of the Terran Empire, their GW I enemy. We can't say much more than that the founding leaders were probably of Muslim background and may have been influenced more by legend and literature than historical continuity. I've mentioned elsewhere some connotations of the title "sultan". I had in mind that they drew from a number of present-day countries, particularly the Gulf states and Malaysia, but they could have been no more Middle Eastern than .. best not to get distracted by random examples


Okay. I only mentioned it because I like to keep naming conventions within a restricted standard. For example, I usually use Latin for naming Thuldan stuff, as they have tried to model themselves on the Roman Empire. It seems most of the names are intended to be English.
offline PM Email Poster
Quote Post
cobalt_phoenix, Group: Heroes, Beyond Level 20 submitted 2 Resources has rated 6 resources, submitted 0 artworks and is involved with 0 projects.

Author
The problem with using "defense sectors" is that they are never defined in terms of what they are. Are they all the same size, or does it vary by nation? Are they geographically identical cubes, or are they organized around specific stars and thus can vary within a stellar nation?

I would lean more towards thinking of a defense sector as being similar to the numbered fleets of the US Navy. In that case, they are somewhat geographical, but they are intended to organize the defensive forces of a stellar nation. As a result, I assume they may or may not be administrative (that would depend on the stellar nation), and they may not all be the same size.


I want to clarify what I meant with this a little bit more.

To me, a defense sector is not always within a stellar nation. To me, a defense sector can be defined as such: a unified military command with set geographical boundaries, usually where a nation has a vested political and/or economic interest.

You can think of them in the same way as Unified Combatant Commands of the US. As such, they combine all of a nation's military forces (including Army, Navy, Planetary Defense, and Special Forces) under a single commander, who then reports to the nation's General Staff (and ultimately the Commander-in-Chief). The specific commander for a defense sector is usually going to be either a Navy admiral or Army general (in either case, either 3 or 4 stars).

With that being said, they are not always within a stellar nation's boarders. For example, the Hatire Community, Borealis Republic, and Insight have the weakest militaries and are also the smallest stellar nations. Generally speaking, none of them have shown a huge amount of political interest outside of their own space (the Inseers are too young, the Borealins are too invested in philosophy, and the Hatire despise tech too much; note, that doesn't mean that they have no external interests, but they lack both the desire and military might to pursue them). As such, they probably have only one or two defense sectors outside of their space, and that's at most. I could easily see them as having all of them contained within their boarders.

By contrast, the Thuldan Empire has galaxy-spanning interests, as well as the muscle to pursue them. I can easily see only 12 defense sectors within their space, with the remaining 16 being beyond their boarders. Some of these could be within another nations space (just like the US Combatant Commands are set up to fight on other people's turf), and other would include sections of Open Space. All Thuldan military resources within the designated areas are then under the command of a single officer, reporting straight to the Emperor. The same concept would be true of VoidCorp (though the commanders would report to the COO's office and/or the Board of Directors, with the CEO serving as CIC).

The Galactic Concord, however, is an interesting study. By treaty, the Concord is responsible for not only its own space, but Open Space as well. With 30 defense sectors, that is potentially 30 different commanders, all overseeing Concord operations. In that case, the Concord may very well have the Verge down as a defense sector, and the same goes for the Far Reach and the Orion Frontier. The areas of open space between these frontier sectors and the Stellar Ring may be much larger, but the Concord has fewer interests there and so the forces are more dilute.



Author
I thought of them as similar in size to those shown in the Stellar Nation Netbook finished chapters, which vary in size between nations, probably rightly so, but for the closest nations, show 10 sectors in StarMech space and 28 in the Thuldan Empire.


I love the Stellar Netbook chapters. The ideas they played with were wonderful. But with that said, there are a few, shall we say, hiccups?

For example, look at the defense sectors of the Thuldan Empire. The map shows Thuldan Prime as sitting just about 35 ly from the Solar boarder, and 50 ly from the boarders with Concord Taurus and the Hatire Community. That is their primary capital system, home to their beloved Emperor, and it is within easy reach of a fortress ship task force from what is one of their oldest, most powerful, and most hated enemies. So what do they do? Set up a buffer sector (sector two, known as "the Gauntlet") to defend it.

My question: What good is a defense sector as a buffer when said sector can be easily bypassed by a powerful force? The Gauntlet is only about, what, 10 to 15 light-years across? A cruiser can jump farther than that. A battleship, battlecruiser, or fleet carrier can jump from the Solar boarder and arrive within Thuldan Prime. A fortress ship, dreadnought, super dreadnought, or super carrier could jump from 10 light-years within Solar space and arrive within Thuldan Prime in 5 days. In either case, they completely negate the purpose of the Gauntlet's existence.

Now, I will say that the Thuldans seem to realize this, and have devoted a huge amount of firepower to protecting Thuldan Prime. The systems PDF even has its own dreadnought, which should be incredibly rare, and a Thuldan fortress ship task force makes regular stops as it patrols Ironheart (the sector containing Thuldan Prime). Obviously, the Thuldans have amassed a major military force within Ironheart sector.

But that is not necessarily a good thing. As most of the star systems inside both Ironheart and the Gauntlet are within easy jump distance of a task force, the Solars may not like the fact that so much firepower is so close. More than likely, that is going to encourage them to place just as much firepower right near the boarder, at various intervals. Of course, the Thuldans are probably not going to like the massing of troops and ships within striking range of their capital system, so they are either going to complain to the Galactic Consulate, threaten the Solars, amass even more troops and ships, or some combination thereof (my money is on "all of the above").

Again, it is a great idea, and I love the concept of using defense in depth for the Thuldans, but it doesn't make a lot of sense with the way it is presented. Just like with piracy and commerce raiding, the only defense the Thuldans can use is to plant large numbers of ship into systems such as Thuldan Prime and leave them there. With that said, the Gauntlet is probably about the safest area of Thuldan space to ever exist.


Oh, and I included a couple of screen shots from the Thuldan and Solar Netbooks. Just look at how close their worlds are to each other's boarders, and tell me that any task forces traveling through there would not be considered a threat.

Attached Image
Attached Image
offline PM Email Poster
Quote Post
uncle_jimbo, Group: Grid Cop, 5éme Corbin submitted 63 Resources has rated 119 resources, submitted 0 artworks and is involved with 3 projects.

Author (cobalt_phoenix @ Sep 5 2016, 05:55)
Page 86, column 2, first paragraph:  "All in all, the Verge is a sector of space about 100 light-years long, wide, and deep."

OK, thanks. That's not fatal, just continuing with the idea that "sector" is a flexible term and the Verge is a bit larger than most (not by much - from what I've said in the campaign document, my Lucian Sector will be pretty near 90 light-years across).

If "sector" meant 100 x 100 x 100 light-years, there would be no need to include those dimensions, or at least a comma should appear: "a sector of space, about 100 light-years..." Uniform cubes are not much use for anything but .. dividing the galaxy into cubes, or satisfying the cultural urges of a race like Traveller's Vilani who have reason to be terrified of disorder and change. They don't represent cultural, administrative, military or economic facts, as a cursory look at most Traveller sector descriptions will show. If we were going to organise star systems astrographically, we'd cite the coordinates of the stars themselves, not an arbitrary location within 50 light-years.


Following the format I've used in The Taurus Contract, I had some quick thoughts for adjustments:

Okavango Sector
Other adjustments: Once the capital region of Sothvec Industries, the Thuldan Empire deported whole populations of useful workers back into their own territory, leaving worlds eerily fallow to return to lush natural growth. If generating details for planets in Okavango Sector using my "Environment Class" resource, adjust the roll for settlement for Class 1 worlds by +1, making it less likely for a current settlement to appear.

Holstein Sector
Other adjustments: Holstein boasts many terraformed planets, but has become known since the close of hostilities for its inhabitants' suspicion that offworlders might interfere with their comfortable lives, making them stereotypically insular, unfriendly and in places downright peculiar. If generating details for planets in Holstein Sector using the GMG, a GM could choose to roll twice for planetary environment on Table G64 for temperate, hot and cold worlds and pick the result most favourable for Series I life, but also to increase the Law Level of any settlements by 1.

This post has been edited by uncle_jimbo on Jan 2 2017, 02:10
offline PM Email Poster Users Website
Quote Post
uncle_jimbo, Group: Grid Cop, 5éme Corbin submitted 63 Resources has rated 119 resources, submitted 0 artworks and is involved with 3 projects.

I wanted to set down some ideas that have been a bit complex to get into order, but could be important to more than one piece of work.

Chatoyant Sector

Rimward of the long-settled Pair O' Dice Sector and bordering former Sothvec space, the bulk of this region consists of a gaggle of colonies who share a number of philosophical and economic traits. Quickly discontented with Earth rule, many assumed for a long time they would organise into a political entity of various proposed names, but the project was never accomplished until they were absorbed by StarMech's efforts to consolidate against Thuldan threats.

Between the Galactic Wars, Chatoyant became a centre for a form of biotechnology, no longer favoured in StarMech culture, that emphasised gene-modification for aesthetics and pleasure, including cloning, engineering for unusual appearance, aquatic and aerial modifications, gender experiments, creation of various novel pets and alteration of other sentient species.

Some hard-line adherents of Thuldan ideology condemned these developments as frivolous, offensive and non-contributory to human genetic superiority. Violent incidents in the lead-up to open war were widely blamed on Thuldan sympathiser cells or covert interference by the Empire. Nevertheless, after StarMech withdrew its forces and the sector was overrun, many inhabitants were not unwilling to join the Thuldans, either because of, or contributing to, lasting blame for alleged treachery aiding the invaders' progress. Key laboratories and skilled personnel either were captured by the Empire or fled elsewhere.

In time, the course of the war turned, passing star systems back and forth repeatedly in different offensives and inflicting revenge attacks by bitter and frustrated leaders of both sides, as were seen in several theatres of the war. In the increasing periods of stalemate, with borders unmoved for years at a time and less-vital systems occupied by neither side, the descendants of engineered populations who no longer felt accepted anywhere in the surrounding nations began to congregate here again.


Defeated Stellar Nation: Radiant Coalition: Descendants retain the sector's legacy of genetic improvements, advanced medical care and, not least, their tolerant, peaceful and aesthetic ideals. A character with affinity to the Radiant Coalition who has not received other stellar nation benefits can choose to increase her Personality score to 15, if human, or 14, if t'sa.


Retroviral Serums: Products of pre-war research can fetch high prices if retrieved from sealed cryogenic storage.

If viable and properly administered, a retroviral serum triggers physical changes in adult individuals, over a period of uncomfortable regrowth and adjustment, edit: following the rules for disease. The recipient gains specific mutant advantages. Depending on the original progress of research and state of preservation of the serum, the recipient may gain more, less or a random amount of drawback points, drawbacks may be known or rolled randomly and the disease-like adaptation effect may make the subject Ill, up to Extremely Ill, may be potentially fatal (Terminally Ill), or a result of Terminally Ill may indicate the treatment failed or only applied mutant drawbacks.

The recipient becomes an engineered mutant with unique advantages, but doesn't change his current skills, skill points or other existing elements that may have been determined by his normal human or mutant status. A retroviral serum works only for one species.

This post has been edited by uncle_jimbo on Oct 4 2018, 10:37
offline PM Email Poster Users Website
Quote Post
cobalt_phoenix, Group: Heroes, Beyond Level 20 submitted 2 Resources has rated 6 resources, submitted 0 artworks and is involved with 0 projects.

Author
If "sector" meant 100 x 100 x 100 light-years, there would be no need to include those dimensions, or at least a comma should appear: "a sector of space, about 100 light-years..." Uniform cubes are not much use for anything but .. dividing the galaxy into cubes, or satisfying the cultural urges of a race like Traveller's Vilani who have reason to be terrified of disorder and change. They don't represent cultural, administrative, military or economic facts, as a cursory look at most Traveller sector descriptions will show. If we were going to organise star systems astrographically, we'd cite the coordinates of the stars themselves, not an arbitrary location within 50 light-years.


This I agree with. We don't have anything that says how big a sector is (much less how many types of sectors there are in S*D). The only thing we actually know is that the table in the S*DCS tells us that nation "A" has "x" number of defense sectors. That is why I gave my interpretation of it. Even the GMG doesn't have a rating for how big a sector is (table G57 on page 190, and I would still take that as a suggestion and not a rule).

I do see a benefit of mapping out a geographic sector as a 100 x 100 x 100 ly area of space, but that may only be for use with the coordinate system and interstellar navigation (basically, a coordinate could be given with a reference to the geographic sector, such as 0/0/0-V for Aegis in the Verge).



Oh, and here is an interesting twist you may like, Jimbo. The Warbeast is Sothvec.

The Thuldans are good at genetic engineering for humans, but not for other species. However, Sothvec Industries (as described on page 95 of the S*D Star Compendium) was known for agriculture and livestock, specifically "in adapting Earth-based animals to life in space and alien worlds." That would seem to say that Sothvec Industries was far more advanced in genetic manipulation of non-human genomes than the Thuldans.

With that said, I can see a desperate Sothvec leadership using that knowledge to create the Warbeast to turn the tide of war or as revenge for defeat. Maybe the Thuldans got their hands on the tech and started tweaking it for their own purposes and desires, but the origin is still Sothvec. As a result, a number of former Sothvec worlds are now haunted by a number of species all created by the same program responsible for the Warbeast, and they have spread to other systems as well. The Warbeast was merely the most successful (and dangerous) of them.
offline PM Email Poster
Quote Post
uncle_jimbo, Group: Grid Cop, 5éme Corbin submitted 63 Resources has rated 119 resources, submitted 0 artworks and is involved with 3 projects.

Author (uncle_jimbo @ Sep 11 2016, 09:41)
Retroviral Serums: Products of pre-war research can fetch high prices if retrieved from sealed cryogenic storage.

I should probably look over this version:

Mutagenic Retrovirus

This post has been edited by uncle_jimbo on Sep 20 2016, 10:48
offline PM Email Poster Users Website
0 User(s) are reading this topic (0 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:
« Next Oldest | Star*Drive | Next Newest »

Topic Options Pages: (4) [1] 2 3 ... Last » Reply to this topicStart new topicStart Poll